The Dr. Jeff Show Ep. 20 – Cal Thomas

Episode 20: Summary & Transcript

Disclaimer: Please note that this is an automatically generated transcript. Although the transcription is largely accurate, it may be incomplete or inaccurate in some cases due to inaudible passages or transcription errors.

Episode Summary

This interview with columnist Cal Thomas covers his extensive career in journalism, his views on the decline of the modern media, and his reflections on Christian engagement in politics. Dr. Jeff Myers and Thomas discuss Thomas’s early days at NBC News, contrasting the journalism of that era with what he described as the advocacy and propaganda of today. Thomas reflects on his past involvement with the Moral Majority, concluding that seeking political solutions for spiritual problems was a major distraction.

The main focus of the conversation is Thomas’s book, America’s Expiration Date, in which he argues that the United States is exhibiting the same signs of decline as past fallen empires, such as massive debt, uncontrolled immigration, and a loss of shared morality. He contends that the solution is not political, but a return to personal faith, prayer, and living out Christian virtues like service and love for one’s enemies.

Episode Transcript

Dr. Jeff Myers (00:02):
Hey, it’s Dr. Jeff Myers. Welcome to the Dr. Jeff Show. On this show, we interview major thought leaders from all areas of life to show that worldview changes everything. My guest today is the legendary columnist journalist, Cal Thomas. Cal asks an interesting question. Do nations have an expiration date, just like the food in our pantry? Because if nations do have an expiration date and it is about 250 years, which is about the average, then we are coming up on our expiration date in just the next few years.

Let me tell you a little about Cal before he comes on the show. He was a reporter for NBC News. He had a show on Fox News. He wrote regularly for USA Today. In fact, 500 newspapers across the country, he’s written several books on morality and politics. And his latest book, America’s Expiration Date, compares the United States to similar superpowers in the past to see what caused them to crumble and what we can do to avoid a similar fate. This is going to be practical and very personal help. Please, welcome to the show, Cal Thomas. Cal Thomas, welcome to the Dr. Jeff Show.

Cal Thomas (01:19):
Thanks very much for having me.

Dr. Jeff Myers (01:20):
Well, I’m looking forward to our conversation. I’ve read your columns for years. I’ve read two and a half of your books and really enjoyed your work. And I’m very excited to have a chance to talk about especially some things that are in your new book that came out in 2020, America’s Expiration Date, because in the book you point out that looking through nine different civilizations in history, that basically the golden age of a civilization is about 250 years, which would put America’s expiration date at July 4th, 2026.

So that is just over five years away from now. And I know in the book you don’t do this to try to make any kind of end times predictions, but to alert people to what our serious problems are and what we need to be doing about them. So I cannot wait to dig into that part of the conversation.

(02:15):
I’ve got so many questions for you about your study of history, which I think a lot of our viewers and listeners are going to find fascinating. But my first question is, I want to go back to get to know you a little bit. Can you talk to us a little bit about how you got to be a journalist? Because we’ve all seen you on Fox News, we’ve read your columns, we’ve heard your radio commentaries, but how did you get into this to start with?

Cal Thomas (02:44):
Well, I started in radio when I was 16 years old. I like to say about two weeks after my voice changed. And then when I was 18, I flunked out of college the year before. I went to school too early. I wasn’t really ready for it. And I managed to get a job as a copy boy at NBC News in Washington before returning to college a year later and met some of the really great journalists of that day. I was in charge of filing their scripts and it became my writing class.

And I originally was interested in show business. I have memorized a lot of musical comedies, but then I realized there was a lot of showbiz in the news and a lot of news in the show biz. So I stayed in journalism, and the column started, it’s a long story, but it started in 1984 and quickly became the most widely syndicated column in America in roughly 500 newspapers.

(03:49):
Now newspapers are in trouble now and a lot of them have dumped content, which seems to me to be rather silly. If you want to sell a product, you ought to have content. So I’m still in, around, I think, 250, 300 papers, something like that, which is not too bad these days.

Dr. Jeff Myers (04:06):
Do people reach out to you after they read your columns? Do they email or get in contact? Because I’m curious how people respond to it and even how that response has changed during the time you’ve been doing the column.

Cal Thomas (04:19):
Not so much anymore. I used to get 50, 100 or more letters a month that was sent to me by my syndicate and then it kind of trailed off. I guess my enemies, my opponents gave up in trying to either intimidate or change me. And the proponents don’t write usually, which is another issue. I included some of my hate mail in my previous book called What Works.

And I couldn’t put the nasty stuff in there, but I put some of the funny stuff in there. When I used to do commentary for NPR, the only conservative commentator on there, somebody wrote and said, “Is there some kind of inbreeding program at NPR that produces a guy like Thomas?” I love that. That was creative.

Dr. Jeff Myers (05:10):
I want to get into journalism a little bit because I know a lot of the young adults who come through a Summit Ministries program are thinking maybe I could go into something like that. But let’s go back to your experience at NBC News. And you mentioned that you were a copy boy. That probably needs to be explained what that is and what you did and who these people were, whose scripts you were going over.

Cal Thomas (05:42):
Well, let’s start with them. These were men, all men then, and we added women later, who had come out of newspapers or wire services. They knew how to write. They were really journalists before they came to broadcasting. And people of a certain age, like many who are watching this now, unless they know a history of journalism, may not have heard of Huntley and Brinkley, might have heard of Walter Cronkite and some of these others who had backgrounds of coverage of World War II and following, they were all really, really good writers.

And so I figured since I wanted to be a decent writer and wanted to be a journalist, I ought to pay attention to what they were saying. I tell young people today, find an experienced, older person and ask them questions, have them pour their life into you. Older people love to give advice.

(06:39):
That’s why I’m on the program today because older people gave me advice and it’s free. You don’t have to go to class for it. If you want to learn to play golf, go out and play with somebody who’s better than you. If you want to learn to be a good swimmer, get in the pool and learn to swim with somebody who’s better than you, they’ll improve your life. So these were my mentors and I had them all on my wall in my office. I had them all sign their pictures before I left NBC and they looked down on me every day to remind me of what real journalism looks like.

Dr. Jeff Myers (07:11):
So contrast that real journalism with what you see today. What was it about that then and where are we now?

Cal Thomas (07:20):
Well, there is no real journalism today, sad to say. And I don’t mean to sound like an old guy who says our generation was better than the current one, but it’s true. It’s advocacy today. It is propaganda. It is an awful lot of people in the business who come from mostly Democratic Party backgrounds. You have George Stephanopoulos on ABC was a Clinton advisor. You had Chris Matthews who for years was on MSNBC and he worked for Tom Foley, the former Speaker of the House. You have Chuck Todd, hosted Meet the Press who used to work for Tom Harken, Senator, Democrat from Iowa.

All of these people with no real journalism background who just got put on TV. Now back in the day, real journalists would cover lousy stories like the emergency room at the local hospital on a Saturday night or school board meetings or some of these other things to earn their stripes.

(08:18):
But now you get catapulted into anchor status making millions of dollars a year. It’s just crazy. And all the polls show that the huge majority of the people don’t trust what is collectively now known as the media, not journalists, but the media, precisely because they see them promoting a point of view or ignoring stories that are legitimate, but that they just don’t want to cover.

Dr. Jeff Myers (08:45):
Are people like Chuck Todd and Chris Matthews and others, are they making the editorial decisions or are they just sort of reading scripts that are given to them by their company?

Cal Thomas (08:55):
Yeah, well, it’s a little bit of both. Worldview is key. I mean, there are really only two worldviews. The one that we are evolutionary accidents evolve from slime. And the reason we like bananas on our cereal is that our nearest relative is down at the zoo. No real purpose in life other than just the three score and 10 we live average and no destination after we die.

And then the other worldview is that we’re created in the image and likeness of an infinite personal God who loves us, has a plan for our life and has redemptive power in Jesus Christ for those who come to him. So those two have been in conflict since the Garden of Eden. There’s really nothing new under the sun. I’m plotting through Carl Sandberg’s brilliant four volume book on Abraham Lincoln the war years. And what is astounding is that nothing has really changed.

(09:48):
The media, it may have changed electronically and social media, but you still had people who hated Lincoln, you had political rivals. And the reason nothing has really changed is because human nature never changes. You could ride a horse or ride in a car or fly in an airplane. You can put on a toga or a suit or a dress, but you can’t change your human nature.

And I think that’s one of the things that modern journalism ignores. They’re constantly looking for new programs or new ideas to improve the human race. And yet there’s nothing that’s going to improve the human race. We aren’t not in need of reformation, we’re in need of redemption. And when we have that worldview, then we can actually accomplish something that promotes the general welfare, not the welfare of a particular party or position.

Dr. Jeff Myers (10:39):
Yeah. Wow. What you’re saying is a powerful realization for me that everybody who’s watching or listening to this right now, I can’t remember who said this, but there are no passengers on the ship of life, only crew, and that we all have this responsibility to improve our writing skills, improve our communication, speak the truth, speak redemptively. Calvin, before, at some point along the way in your career, and this is before a lot of the people who are watching or listening right now were born.

So this is kind of the history lesson. You helped to form an organization called the Moral Majority. And in that work, the goal was to exert a stronger Christian influence on society. And later on you wrote a book Blinded by Mike, which was very controversial and created a tremendous amount of discussion, but it was an effort for Christians to try to say, “Let’s get into the public’s fear.” Some of it worked well, some of it didn’t.

(12:01):
I just wonder if you could comment on that a little bit and then maybe, because we’re going to eventually get around toward the end of this show, what should we be doing now?

Cal Thomas (12:10):
Well, there have always been attempts throughout history to use government or political power to improve the human condition. You had prohibition, you had moral rearmament, you had the Christian coalition, you had the moral majority. The notion was that if we could just elect enough people who believed as we did, we could have trickled down morality from Washington, from politicians who have a difficulty in imposing on themselves, you may have noticed.That is a major distraction and mistake.

Now, is it okay? Is it fine to serve in public office? Of course, but we shouldn’t be under any illusion that government is going to repair fallen humanity. This is a distraction, I think, from our great adversary. So the question, we’re just passing through this world. This is not our home. Can we do certain things while we’re here to promote justice and racial equality and all of these other noble causes?

(13:16):
Yes, of course we can. But the greater power we have is in the gospel of Jesus Christ. The greatest power is to change a life and only God can do that. My friend, Bob Beckel, Liberal Democrat, used to debate him on television and other things, had the privilege of leading him to Christ.

And he was always pro-choice on abortion, but as he read the scripture and as he prayed, he realized that that was a position that was antithetical to scripture and to God’s view of human life. And so he came around to the other point of view. Now that wasn’t through my power of persuasion, that was the power of the Holy Spirit, teaching him things. So I think we get off track when we think we have to do stuff. Oswald Chambers says, “We don’t have to do anything. We just have to be.”

(14:06):
“Let God do the work through us.” And what are the greatest evangelistic tools ever given to us? They were given to us by Jesus of Nazareth. They weren’t about organizing. They weren’t about political life. Jesus said, “My kingdom is not of this world.” They were, love your enemies, pray for those who persecute you, care for widows and orphans, visit those in prison.

And what are we known for among the pagans, the non-believers? We’re known for what we’re against and who we hate and Donald Trump and all of these other things that have nothing to do with the gospel. So Satan is the great distractor and he wants us to fight him all the time in what he’s doing. And every time we do that, we take away from doing what God wants us to do, which is to be his and let him do the greater work.

(14:57):
When Jesus said, “Greater works than these, you will do.” I always thought that meant I could raise the dead or give sight to the blind. No, no. It was about him multiplying himself and believers throughout the world. When he was here with us in body, he was limited in space and time. Now he’s unlimited and Christ in you is the greatest power we have. And the reason it is not more effective is that too many of us don’t apply it properly.

Dr. Jeff Myers (15:24):
Yeah. Cal, what would that look like in the workplace? A lot of students come through.

Cal Thomas (15:29):
I have a great story about that.

Dr. Jeff Myers (15:31):
Yeah, please.

Cal Thomas (15:32):
Brought it up. I was visiting some years ago, a newspaper editor in Florida. And at the end, there was a man there who said, “Could I see you for a few minutes in a hallway?” I said, “Sure.” So he said, “Look, I’m the only Christian on the staff here. I never get my ideas in the editorials. Nobody respects my point of view. I’m thinking of leaving and going into, pardon me, full-time Christian service.” Hate that phrase.

I said, “There’s an alternative, part-time, half-time, whatever.” I said, “Let me ask you a question. Your colleague who sits next to you there, do you know how she takes her coffee in the morning? Could you go get it for her? Your boss, do you know the name of his wife and how many kids he has? Could you go out to lunch with your colleagues and not bring God up once and just take an interest in them?”

(16:25):
“If you do these things, if you become a servant, then God is going to do some great things through you.” He wrote me about six months later and said that he had just gotten promoted to a New York Times newspaper doing what I told him he should do. So the neat thing about loving your enemies is when you love them, very often they cease to be your enemies, plus you confound the other side. I have many, many, many liberal Democrat friends. They still don’t know why I really care about them.

Tell you one of my favorite stories when I was working at CNN, a producer there noticing something a little different about me, which usually doesn’t take very long, said, “What are you?” I said, “Tall.” She said, “No, no. Where do you go to church?” I said, “I am the church.” She said, “Look wise guy, what are you doing Sunday morning?” I said, “Well, depending on how I feel, I grab a cup of coffee, take a shower, read the newspaper.” Then I really had her retention.

(17:18):
She said, “Look, when you leave the house, where do you go?” I gave her an address. She said, “Is there a building there?” I said, “Yeah.” She said, “What’s the name of the building?” I said, “What are you trying to get at?” She said, “I want to know what you believe.” I said, “Now we can have a conversation.”

But we built this structure around this person named Jesus of Nazareth and nobody can get to him. It’s like the archeologist who has to dig down through several layers of civilization to find what he or she is looking for. We built all of this stuff, politics and issues around Jesus, but the greatest issue is we are sinners and in the face of a holy God.

We deserve condemnation and yet God in his great mercy sent his son Jesus to die in our place, to take our place on the cross and proving he was different than any religious leader who’s ever lived, rose from the grave and offers us the hope of heaven if we will come to him on his terms. That’s the most powerful message we can ever share with any human being on earth.

Dr. Jeff Myers (18:19):
The Apostle Paul talks about us being ambassadors and that’s a good term that you’re going forward, not representing yourself, you’re representing something greater than yourself. You’re representing Jesus. Boy, that’s a good lesson for us in the days of social media where it seems like everything is, you have to divide up into two sides. Those two sides have to clash because that’s how the social media companies are going to get advertising dollars.

Cal Thomas (18:46):
Well, it’s not only on social media. If you look at television, you see these so- called two sides, people yelling at each other. Nothing is ever resolved, nothing. You have this whole critical race theory now and systemic racism, and you’ve got the president again promising all kinds of money on various programs. We’ve spent over $11 trillion on anti-poverty programs. We’ve had open housing laws. We’ve had civil rights legislation.

I’m not saying those were not good things. They were good things, but they don’t really address the human heart. And if something isn’t working in business, you change the model or you go out of business, only in government. Ronald Reagan used to have a great line. He had so many, but he said, “The only proof of eternal life in Washington is a government program.”

Dr. Jeff Myers (19:35):
Right, right. I actually just used that quote the other day with somebody because that is exactly how it goes. So we want to turn our attention. We obviously need to be involved as citizens and we’ve talked about that in other episodes of the show, but we don’t want to assume that our vote is the main way our voice is going to be heard. We’re ambassadors for Christ. We’re doing that in the workplace and every place else. But I’d like to get into a little bit of your book. You published this in, I think it was January of 2020. So just before.

Cal Thomas (20:10):
Yeah, great timing, just before the pandemic.

Dr. Jeff Myers (20:14):
Quite possibly the worst time in the last 30 years to release a book. But the book is a warning. It’s America’s expiration date and you go through nine different civilizations and these civilizations each, they expired at some point. The founding ideas that made them strong, they gave up on them and then began to fall apart. So I wanted to dig into that a little bit.

In these nine different civilizations, and by the way, for those, we’re going to have a show note here so you can know how to get the book, but you go all the way from Persia to America. And then along the way, there’s the Byzantine Empire, the Russian. So you cover all these different civilizations. What would you say, or in our cultural moment, some of the key lessons that you learned from that that we should be paying attention to?

Cal Thomas (21:06):
Well, the book was inspired by an essay by the late Sir John Globe, the English diplomat, who studied over 3000 years of human history and found that there was a pattern to the decline of nations. Number one on his list, uncontrolled immigration without assimilation. Does anyone deny we have that problem today? Number two, massive national debt. We are approaching $30 trillion in debt. It would have shocked and amazed the founders. Our national debt is greater than the gross domestic product of most other nations, maybe all other nations now.

Thirdly, a loss of a shared moral sense. Look at all of the things we tolerate and promote today. Transgenderism, gender identity, gay pride month, and all of these other things. So a loss of a shared moral sense, and then a lack of faith in God. We see from the polls that millennials and those who followed no longer have the faith that our fathers and grandfathers and grandparents had.

(22:13):
There is now, half the country, more than half now, has no religious or church affiliation according to numerous polls from Gallup to Barna. This is a very dangerous trend. If you do not have a faith and a power and an authority higher than government in an eternal God who exists subjectively, then you are subject to all kinds of problems. And I mean, we’re just talking practicality here, not religiously.

(22:43):
The founders, many, many leaders of our country have all spoke of their faith in God and the essence of a nation. The verse in scripture, righteousness exalts a nation, but sin is a reproach to any people. Well, we are being reproached now by things that my grandmother would have washed my mouth out with soap if I even dared to mention them. The abnormal is now being promoted as normal. Sin is now promoted as righteousness. It is amazing.

And the United States of America is a unique country. Most of the world is under religious oppression, political dictatorship, lack of women’s rights, the lack of a free press. The United States is an oasis, but it’s, again, as Reagan used to say, we’re only one generation away from losing it all. This is not the natural state of humanity. And if people remember library books, you had to go to renew a book. If it lasted, if you kept it beyond two or three weeks or whatever it was, we have to renew our democracy, our constitutional republic, or it will expire.

Dr. Jeff Myers (23:56):
Tell me, there’s so many questions in my head right now. Let me start with this one because some of the civilizations you examined in the book, Persia, for example, and others, there was an issue of whether they were being true to their ideals, there is the issue of properly managing the government, but they had no belief in God, but yet they somehow sustained. Was there something about their core beliefs that allowed them to be strong? And is that central to what a nation needs?

Cal Thomas (24:31):
Well, some of them, of course, had their own gods. Persia, Rome had many gods and Paul addressed that in his message about the unknown God. But there was a certain uniformity of either belief or unbelief, and that is what held some of these empires together. But again, human nature, military overreach, the expansion, just take the British empire. It was said that the sun never said on the British empire. Well, now the sun barely rises on it.

What was one of their major problems? It was overextension. The empire was too big. They couldn’t maintain it. They kept raising taxes in order to pay all the occupiers in India and everywhere else. And then the people rebelled and the British people said, “Look, we don’t want to pay for this kind of stuff anymore. It’s not really in our interest to do so.” Persia was incredible in terms of mathematics and artistic things.

(25:32):
And you hear about Persian rugs today, and of course it’s modern day Iran, which is totally different from the past. But when you read this book and then you read the reprints of Solzenitsin’s speech at Harvard and the Templeton Prize, if ever there was a modern prophet, Solzenitson was it. His Harvard speech was brilliant. He warned, this was 40 years ago now, that the direction in which America was headed meant its doom.

I remember the late Catholic bishop Fulton J. Sheen who said, “America is not intolerant,” as some say. America is tolerant of everything, and that’s the problem. If there is no right or wrong, if there is no objective truth, then we are subject to the winds of the spirit of the age. And I fear that that is what we are in the midst of right now.

Dr. Jeff Myers (26:27):
We have got to put in the show notes, talking to our producer over the camera now, we’ve got to put it in our show notes that Solsanison speech from Harvard, 1976. That should be a must read essay for everybody who is watching or listening to this right now. Cal, this is a question because you have so many friends who are on the other side of the aisle, so to speak, that I think you can uniquely address that a lot of people have been wondering about.

We see so much in the media with people who are progressives, they’re on the far left, they’re promoting Marxism, but that’s not most people. There have got to be areas where people who are maybe little bit left of center, right of center, there’s got to be things about the American ideal we can agree on to sort of form a new majority rather than just continually submit to this idea that we have to have some sort of a class warfare and a revolution in order for anything to get better. What would be some of those things that you would say we could orient around?

Cal Thomas (27:36):
Well, first I would go back to something that the late Barbara Bush, wife of President George H. W. Bush said at Wellesley College of all places in Massachusetts, she said, “Men and women, if you have children, they must come first. Our success as a nation, your success as a family depends less on what happens in the White House and more on what happens in your house.”

So I think we have to begin with education and modern education is not education at all. It is indoctrination. I have preached this message for years. Some people actually listen to it. We’ve got to pull our kids out of the government schools and the universities. We do not send our troops to China or to Russia or to Iran to be trained. We train them here with our philosophy, our beliefs, our weapons, and our agenda. So why would you send your children into these reeducation camps that teach a revisionist kind of history?

(28:41):
We’re so far behind China and other countries in math and science. We’re way ahead on gender identification and transgenderism and all kinds of other things, black studies and all these things. They’re not really educating people for the modern age. So it starts with education. Then I think that you have to belong to the kingdom that is not of this world. You have to view yourself. You mentioned the word citizen.

Well, yeah, okay. My passport says I’m a citizen of the United States, but I don’t really have a passport for the citizenship of the kingdom that is not of this world. It’s difficult because we do want to be in the majority. We do see our values threatened all the time, but what did we expect the end times to look like? Paul said in the end, men will believe whatever their itching ears want to hear.

(29:37):
Don’t we have that today? Jesus talked about all of the things of the end times. Daniel, one of the great Old Testament prophets, saw visions of the end times. So don’t worry, don’t be afraid. Everything is right on schedule, but do what you know is true and practice what you believe and the world will stand back and marvel.

Dr. Jeff Myers (30:02):
Your book came out just before COVID, just before race riots and all of those kinds of things. Are there any?

Cal Thomas (30:09):
Well, not before race riots. We had those in the 60s.

Dr. Jeff Myers (30:12):
That is true. I was born in Detroit, Michigan, so I have.

Cal Thomas (30:15):
Oh, wow.

Dr. Jeff Myers (30:16):
Now, anything about what’s happened in the last year or so that would adjust your observations? Did it accelerate it? Is there anything that you would put differently in the book if you were to write it now as opposed to two years ago?

Cal Thomas (30:34):
No, I think everything is right on schedule. I wouldn’t change a word. I think it is becoming more prophetic every day as we see what is happening in the news and we see all of these schools and universities and political leaders succumbing. I just saw a story yesterday, an interview with a superintendent of the Loudoun County, Virginia School District, which is a far out suburb of Washington, DC, teaching equity, which is nothing more than a guaranteed equal outcome. A lot of schools have done away with valedictorians and salutatorians. They want to dumb down everybody so nobody feels that worse than somebody else.

(31:26):
When you underscore things that you don’t like, you’re going to get more of them. And when you suppress things that you say you want more of, you’re going to get less of that. So we penalize success and we subsidize failure and lack of accomplishment and are shocked to find that we’re getting more of what we want less of and less of what we want more of. And the politicians and so many others just bow the knee whenever somebody screams at them that they’re a racist or a xenophobe or whatever, and try to prove the opposite, which is impossible.

So I’m really concerned about that. I mean, I’ve got children and grandchildren, and I don’t want them to continue to have to live in a country that is becoming less and less like the one handed down to me by the greatest generation, my parents. But there’s nothing really I can do about it. And again, as the old Baptist hymn says, “I’m pressing on the upward wave, new heights I’m gaining every day.” Or as C.S. Lewis wrote in The Chronicles of Narnia, “Further up and further in.”

Dr. Jeff Myers (32:30):
Yeah. This is good. Well, I love that you see this as somebody who’s been a commentator, someone who’s been in the arena as a dad, as a granddad. Our show comes out on Tuesdays. So think through with me, what should we be doing on Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday based on what we’ve talked about in this discussion? And then maybe a month long or a year long plan here, because so much of our audience, they want to know they’re in their 20s, 30s, they’ve got energy. What can we do?

Cal Thomas (33:07):
Well, you can start with prayer. That’s what we usually end with if we do it at all. How many times have you heard, “All I can do is pray.” Well, you’re calling upon the creator of the universe. That ought to be a first resource, not a last resort. Second, if you have the ability as a writer, as an actor, as a singer, as a musician, something in the arts, go into it. There’s nothing really barring you.

Nobody’s standing in the door keeping you out, but we have kind of a self-fulfilling prophecy that because so much of quote, the media unquote seem hostile to our values. Well, why is that? That’s because more of us aren’t in it. People ask me, “Well, how did you become a successful syndicated columnist?” I didn’t take it as a final verdict that it couldn’t be done. I joined the editorial organizations.

(33:55):
I went around and met newspaper editors around the country, showed them I didn’t have horns. I wasn’t a fanatic that I could write, that I could make my position clear. And they needed conservatives because conservatives were canceling their newspaper subscriptions and I helped win a lot of them back. So I think to have a positive and friendly attitude, and then just to realize that you’re never going to win somebody to your point of view by arguing with them, but you can get them to listen to your point of view by loving them first.

Jesus dined with publicans and sinners. He hung out with the worst of the worst. He shocked and scandalized the Pharisees, but those are the ones he came to save. And since he is in those of us who have received him as Savior, we should be willing and wanting to take him wherever he wants to go, which is among the people who need to know him.

(34:50):
And you mentioned a moment ago that we’re ambassadors and we certainly are, but what does an ambassador do? An ambassador represents the country from which he or she is a citizen and they represent the policies of the head of that country. The head of our country, the one we’re headed for is Jesus of Nazareth. And because we are ambassadors for him, we should have his attitude and practice what he taught us in every possible case and circumstance that he gives us.

Dr. Jeff Myers (35:23):
This has been great, Cal. So our call is very personal. It is one-to-one, being a good neighbor, loving people, caring for people, learning, growing, praying, staying close to the Lord. All of those things that are so easy to forget when you’re in the middle of these battles that you see today.

Cal Thomas (35:48):
Well, God’s power is made perfect in weakness. And you look at the various verses in scripture, the widows might, the mustard seed, the last place at the table, loving your enemies. When I’m weak that I’m strong, humble yourself under the mighty hand of God and he will exalt you in due time if you faint not. Those who wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength. Mount up with wings as eagles run and not be weary, walk and not faint. Over and over and over, the last shall be first. He who would be greatest among you must be your servant.

So we’re told in both testaments about these things and it’s repeated because we are so ignorant and we don’t pay attention. But if we do these things, then the power of God is unleashed through us into the lives of other people. And that’s the most thrilling thing of all, to see someone whose life has been transformed by the power of God is the most amazing and wonderful experience you can have on this earth.

(36:52):
I’ve seen it happen in my life over and over many times. I’ve had the thrill and privilege of sharing Jesus with many people. Many have rejected him, many are indifferent, but many have also come. I get no blame for those who refuse to receive him and I get no credit for those who do. It’s a good bargain.

Dr. Jeff Myers (37:11):
Yeah, Cal. Cal Thomas, thank you so much for coming on the Dr. Jeff Show today. Very grateful for you.

Cal Thomas (37:18):
My great pleasure. Thanks. God bless.

Dr. Jeff Myers (37:26):
Thanks to my guest, Cal Thomas, for joining us today on the show. You can purchase Cal’s book, America’s Expiration Date, wherever books are sold, and you can find Cal Thomas online at calthomas.com and follow him on Twitter @CalThomas. Thanks for watching and we’ll see you next week.

Ryan Dobson (37:45):
Hi, everyone. This is Ryan Dobson from Rebel Parenting. When my parents, Jim and Shirley Dobson chose Summit Ministries Worldview Conference for me when I was 17, who knew how completely transformed my life would be in two short weeks? It changed me so much, I’ve returned every summer for 34 years.

Summit Worldview Conferences challenge students ages 16 to 25 to think deeper about their faith and convictions by engaging with today’s top worldview thinkers and apologists. This summer, your student can attend an in- person conference, that’s right, in person or Summit’s amazing virtual experience. They will be equipped to vigorously articulate biblical truth, meaningfully impact culture, and curb the influence of false worldviews. Join Summit this summer and change the trajectory of your students’ life forever. Click the link in the show notes to learn more.